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  • BangBang

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    "Audio Note UK

    Audio Note’s chief, Peter Qvortrup, was here demonstrating a system around the "AN E/Spe He" and showing off the new Jinro Integrated amplifier, which is a $21,000 version of the Ongaku using less of the premium parts. With around 20 watts and playing very interesting music, something practically non-existent during the entire show, Peter was energetically and enthusiastically illustrating that notions of bass and volume capability with 8-inch woofers and few watts are practically silly notions indeed. Interesting music? How about Finish Symphonic metal? An operatic soprano fused with a hard metal band playing at ridiculous volume levels.

    The bass lines began and Peter got up and walked over to the amp. I expected him to turn the volume level down but no, he turn the volume way up to thunderous hit-you-in-the-chest bass levels and a big grin came across his face with a “let’s see the other rooms do this” kind of expression. Indeed, very few rooms would I suspect. Other rooms were mostly playing soft jazz vocals and flute solos. The E’s can do all of that – no problem – vocal rendition was cohesive like the better single drivers but with real drive bass delineation and pristine, open, fast treble response. Peter then played some sort of noise metal – which lived up to billing. Then Peter played a rather brilliant track by The Evil Nine an Electronica Hip Hop album at crushing volume levels and there’s a ton going on here. Bass lines were full deep and incredibly focused starting and stopping without overhang. Terrific imaging and a large stereo spread. And thanks for playing some interesting music. Needless to say, I found this to be one of the best rooms at CES if music is the priority.

    This room was Audio Note’s less expensive room carrying:

    - CD 3.1x player
    - TT1 turntable
    - M3 RIAA photo stage
    - Jinro integrated amp
    - AN/E SPe HE speakers"


    http://www.dagogo.com/View-Article.asp?hArticle=706
     

    shaunv

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    Rune S skrev:
    Tøfft! 8)
    Hva med å prøve og koble de i serie? , wall of sound! ;D
    Sikkert morro, men bortkastet. :p Spørs vel hvor blid forsterkeren blir?
    bambadoo skrev:
    Beskriv gjerne forskjellene.
    Det blir litt mye å skrive om alle forskjellene mellom tre par høytalere, men kan jo prøve å trekke inn de mest vesentlig forskjellen fra Kit-04 til Kit-03 og SP. Lyden av AN-E finner man i alle, så hvis man setter på typisk pling plong musikk vil kanskje ikke de store forskjellene åpenbare seg med det første. Det Kit-04 med Alnico elementer i diskant og bass gjør i forhold til de andre er at den fører til en tyngde/kropp i lyden som får instrumenter til å høre mer ut som de gjør i virkeligheten, og dette gjør de uten at det går på bekostning av oppløsning/evne til å formidle detaljene i sporet som spilles. Dette fører til at AN-E rett og slett er en høytaler som kan formidle flere typer musikk på en virkelig tilfredstillende måte. De store forskjellene åpenbarer seg når man plutselig kan spille plater som før skar i ørene, på høyt nivå i lang tid uten å bringe fram lyttetretthet. Dette gjelder spesielt for "hardere" musikk.
    Dette er kanskje med på å forklare hvorfor man stadig leser om PQ som slenger på litt atypisk musikk på messer! For den typiske pling plong musikken er jo ingen stor utfordring på å formidle kanskje?
     

    Rune S

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    FallenA , Jinro ser spennende ut! Hadde vert moro å vert tilstede på en av demoene når Peter styrer musikk og ratter volum ;D

    God beskrivelse av lydforskjelene shaunv.Nå begynner jeg nesten å savne kit 04ene ;) Men det skal da bli artig å høre igjen kit 03 også.Sammenligner man med det meste av andre høytalermerker så spiller de billigere musikk så det griner etter,og når jeg hadde kit 03 regnet jeg ikke med at det var mulig å gjøre ting så mye bedre,men det hører du nå,AN klarer det! :)
     

    Brasse

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    "Other rooms were mostly playing soft jazz vocals and flute solos."

    Å fy faen brenne.
    Regner med at den finske metalsymfonien kanskje var Apocalyptica?
     

    BangBang

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    Er utrolig nysgjerrig på Jinro. Og jeg skulle gjerne vært tilstede på messa når Peter "guffet på" litt ;)

    Hva slags Finsk metallsymfoni man snakker om aner jeg ikke.
    Det nevnes også The Evil Nine som ikke er helt i min gate.

    Forsterkeren ser griselekker ut, og skal etter hva jeg leser være temmelig lik Ungaku, men alt sølv er byttet ut med kobber. Og rørene er standard "hyllevare" fra Kina.
    Man snakker vel om veiledende pris på drøye 130K.
     

    LMC

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    og PQ ler hele veien til banken , som vanlig ;D
    mvh
    Leif
     

    BangBang

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    Ikke usannsynlig! ;)

    Leste nettopp noe som jeg tidligere bare hadde hørt om, men ikke tenkt så mye over.
    AN promoterer Ungaku, Kegon etc som sin "high end" line. Etter hva jeg leser i forklaringen til Hiroyasu Kondo ang PQ og hans "skilsmisse" så var dette en ganske heftig prosess.

    Jeg må innrømme at jeg hele tiden har tenkt i de baner at Audio Note UK som selger sine Ungaku etc. var det samme som Audio Note Japan/Kondo. :-\

    http://www.audioasylum.com/cgi/t.mpl?f=general&m=37527

    "Posted by Hiroyasu Kondo on January 20, 2000 at 15:59:26

    Dear friends of Audio Note

    Many of you will know that my former distributor, Audio Note UK, a company controlled by Peter Qvortrup and I have ceased to have a business relationship. I have recently read on the Audio Note UK web site Peter Qvortrup's explanation for this separation. The distortion of the truth is so great that Peter Qvortrup has forced me to go public and explain to you what happen.

    As many of you will know I resigned from CBS Sony where I was an audio designer in mid-1970. At this time, I began using the name Audio Note, and my products were branded with that name. I actually incorporated Audio Note in Japan on October 1, 1979. I was manufacturing high end audio products a long time before I even met Peter Qvortrup. In fact, I had a number of agents prior to Peter Qvortrup being appointed my distributor. He proved himself to be a good salesman of my product and eventually I gave him the right to distribute Audio Note products everywhere except Japan. At no time has he ever been involved in the design, or manufacture, of my products. He is not an amplifier designer.

    Everything went well for a period of time and he purchased goods through my Japanese business agent, Shibazaki san of Sibatech. Peter Qvortrup asked me if he might have permission to manufacturer a lower end audio product bearing the Audio Note name, I gave him a revocable license to do so.

    In 1996 and 1997 problems started to develop, leading me in late 1997 to revoke the license to manufacture products bearing the Audio Note name, and to dismiss him as my distributor.

    Peter Qvortrup has claimed on his web site that we parted company because of some ""severe philosophical divergence on amplifier design", this is not the truth.

    I terminated my business agreement with Peter Qvortrup and Audio Note UK for three main reasons:

    1. Towards the end of our business relationship he had ordered a large quantity of high end Audio Note products manufactured by Audio Note Japan through Sibatec but failed to pay for them.

    2. In August 1997 Messrs Pannel Kerr and Forster accountants, were appointed join administrative receivers in the United Kingdom because Audio Note UK were put into the hands of the Official Receivers and into liquidation. The liquidation of Audio Note UK had a bad effect both financially and in terms of the reputation of the name Audio Note and I found it unacceptable.

    3. Peter Qvortrup has always used the reputation for reliability and excellence to enhance the sale of the Audio Note products made in England under a license granted by me. However, I started to become concerned when I repeatedly heard complaints from people who had bought the English manufactured products telling me that it was badly finished and unreliable. I recognize that while our reputation could help sell the English products, equally their bad reputation could damage the reputation of the products I was building in Japan.

    After I had terminated the agreement with him, I appointed P M Components, in England, as my distributor for Europe. I also granted them a revocable license to manufacture products bearing my name.

    Peter Qvortrup's reaction was firstly to try and threaten people who wish to sell my products with legal action, claiming that the name Audio Note was his. Accordingly, I am a little surprise to see that he now claims on his web site to welcome healthy competition.

    Moreover, he took legal proceedings in England claiming that the name Audio Note was his. I did not contest the proceedings because I did not believe that it was necessary to do so. It is so well known that I created the name Audio Note along with the names of individual products which bear Japanese names, such as ONGAKU, KEGON, KAGEKI. These products were designed by me, manufactured by me and the only role that Peter Qvortrup had was in for a time promoting and selling them. I could not believe that he would after I had ended our business relationship try and claim that he had a right to make products bearing my names.


    Given the confusion that Peter Qvortrup has introduced into the market, I started to put the word "Kondo" on the front of products I now currently design and manufacture.

    This does not mean that I cannot use the name Audio Note, why shouldn't I use the name Audio Note as I am the creator of it. Lately, I have been told that there have been malicious rumors spread about my health, I am very pleased to say that I am fit and well and working hard in Tokyo pursuing my life long quest for audio excellence and with no time, or desire or need to copy anyone else's design.

    Thank you so much for your interest in Audio Note and for your faithful support over the years.

    Please keep an eye out for my new web pages, it will detail all facts."

     
    K

    Kaare G. Opsahl

    Gjest
    Sympatisk dude PQ :-\ Rent ran og en god grunn til ikke å støtte forretningene til PQ etter min oppfattning
     

    BangBang

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    Må innrømme at jeg fikk meg en tankevekker nå!

    Slike ting har sikkert ikke noe i vennetråden å gjøre, men om noen kjenner historien, og har noen inputs på denne hadde jo det vært greit.
     

    Brasse

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    Er vel bare å kjøpe Kits, da disse ikke har noe med Qvortrup å gjøre...
     

    JanR

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    Brasse skrev:
    Er vel bare å kjøpe Kits, da disse ikke har noe med Qvortrup å gjøre...
    Hvis man føler for å boikotte AN uk/PQ ja. Kit's er vel uansett verdt å vurdere, samme hva en måtte mene om PQ. Mye for pengene er vel ett stikkord.

    Trodde vel ærlig talt de fleste AN vennene viste, i grove trekk iaf, historien bak PQ/AN uk.
    Tåler å høre/lese den igjen FA for all del :)

    /jan
     

    BangBang

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    JanR skrev:
    Brasse skrev:
    Er vel bare å kjøpe Kits, da disse ikke har noe med Qvortrup å gjøre...
    Hvis man føler for å boikotte AN uk/PQ ja. Kit's er vel uansett verdt å vurdere, samme hva en måtte mene om PQ. Mye for pengene er vel ett stikkord.

    Trodde vel ærlig talt de fleste AN vennene viste, i grove trekk iaf, historien bak PQ/AN uk.
    Tåler å høre/lese den igjen FA for all del :)

    /jan
    Visste jo det var noe, men har ikke satt meg inn i på hvilken måte "ballongen sprakk". ;)
     

    JanR

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    FallenA skrev:
    JanR skrev:
    Brasse skrev:
    Er vel bare å kjøpe Kits, da disse ikke har noe med Qvortrup å gjøre...
    Hvis man føler for å boikotte AN uk/PQ ja. Kit's er vel uansett verdt å vurdere, samme hva en måtte mene om PQ. Mye for pengene er vel ett stikkord.

    Trodde vel ærlig talt de fleste AN vennene viste, i grove trekk iaf, historien bak PQ/AN uk.
    Tåler å høre/lese den igjen FA for all del :)

    /jan
    Visste jo det var noe, men har ikke satt meg inn i på hvilken måte "ballongen sprakk". ;)
    Nuvel, nå har du lest den ene versjonen. Den andre sto vel på AN uk siden 8)

    Uansett hva de gutta drev og driver med så liker jeg de produktene jeg har stående hjemme. Kommer ikke til å boikotte hverken den ene eller den andre. Ei heller forsvare noen.

    /jan
     

    BangBang

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    Prøvde å finne "den andre siden av historien", men finner ikke noe konkret.
    Så om noen har en lenke.....??! ;)
     
    K

    Kaare G. Opsahl

    Gjest
    FallenA skrev:
    Prøvde å finne "den andre siden av historien", men finner ikke noe konkret.
    Så om noen har en lenke.....??! ;)
    har hørt denne og andre historier om PQ tidligere. Tror det er riktig. Synd fordet er noen veldig bra produkter i "AN" utvalget
     

    bambadoo

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    http://db.audioasylum.com/cgi/m.mpl?forum=general&n=36887&
    Of Thieves, Liars & Magpies.
    In response to Mr. Kondo’s posting of January 16, 2000, I would like to put his comments into the following perspective.
    Mr. Kondo and I worked together for nearly 20 years and during this time we both benefited enormously from each other’s skills, knowledge and understanding. I have learnt a lot from Kondo-san and I hope that in a quiet moment he also appreciates my love of music, commitment to excellence and unyielding support. Our collaboration worked very well for many years, but as in many relationships, business or otherwise, the parties develop in different directions. I wanted to continue to pursue sound quality through further exploration of the single-ended output stage and all manners transformer coupling.
    Mr. Kondo felt in contrast and I believe still feels, as he showed a push-pull 2A3 amplifier at the London High End Show in September 1999. Firstly that the push pull triode output stage can somehow be developed to marshal a return to superiority and secondly that transformers only belong in the output stage of power amplifiers. I always considered this an abandonment of our basic principles and since Kondo-san never presented me with any push pull prototype that proved to be better than any of the SE amplifiers he made, so I have stuck to my views.
    The financial crisis in South East Asia in late 1997 polarised these two divergent philosophies, which then became emotionally and commercially incompatible and Mr. Kondo decided to break off our collaboration and we parted our ways.
    It is never easy to break up after so many years and especially when it also involves a high profile brand, even more so in an industry infested with rumourmongers, hacks and carpet baggers.
    After a brief legal argument Audio Note™ UK Ltd. retained the rights to the brand name registration and Mr. Kondo is now selling his amplifiers under the name Kondo™. The reasons for ANUK retaining the brand name registration are as obvious as they are logical,
    1.)The value in the name was created solely and exclusively by Audio Note UK’s and my personal investment. Kondo-san took no part in the financial, strategic or commercial risks involved in building the brand name recognition.
    2.)Registering a company under the name Audio Note in Japan does not in itself give the rights to a brand, only the hard work and expense building it is what makes it known and worthwhile, emotional attachment alone accounts for little in the real world. Since the product strategy, investment and most of the concepts were formulated in the UK with Kondo-san co-operating willingly, happily going along for the ride, for as long as the annual rewards were always on the increase. There was no-one crying foul then.
    3.)In the end equation is it really so surprising that the brand name stays with the investor, I would have thought that this was normal practice, just ask anyone with money to invest about this and they will tell you the same.
    Therefore there is no question of “stealing” the brand name, intellectually, morally or otherwise so I think we should leave Rossini’s masterpiece out of the discussion, attractive as the emotional connections may be.
    Now to elaborate with a bit of history.
    Since 1990 there were two Audio Note companies, one of which developed and produced its own products under the name Audio Note in the UK and which also specified and distributed Audio Note Japans products and the original company in Japan.
    It is important to note here that it was ANUK who decided which products from AN-J should be marketed outside Japan, and the voice you hear in products like the ONGAKU, GAKU-ON, KEGON and M10 is a mixture of Kondo-san’s and mine. These combination of these two voices are inseparable in these products and was decided upon by myself, and as a result I often deemed many of Mr. Kondo’s products not suitable for wider distribution, much to his considerable chagrin. A fact that undoubtedly contributed to his hostile behaviour during our negotiations in late 1997 and early 1998 and to building his deeply aggrieved attitude later.
    The original agreement was that ANUK would develop the more commercial part of the Audio Note product line (Levels Zero to Three). In addition ANUK should develop a product range complimentary to the Japanese products, capable of displaying their qualities and also provide an overall development platform for improving the concept of music reproduction shared by Kondo-san and I at the time.
    With an investment over 7 years of well over one million pounds, ANUK went ahead and largely fulfilled its obligations under the agreement (which incidentally ran out in 1995 without being renewed and might I ad without much further discussion about brand name, strategy or new terms of contract).
    As a small example, in early 1994 ANUK even paid to send an engineer to Japan to teach and train AN-J staff in quality control procedures, product consistency and layout (amongst other matters showing them how to get the power supply quiet enough to remove the feedback from the ONGAKU). Techniques and concepts that did not at the time exist in any measure at the AN-J factory, one of many such small investments that helped make the AN-J products more saleable.
    From late 1993 I kept Kondo-san very busy building NEIRO’s, ONGAKU’s, GAKU-ON’s, M10’s etc., but by mid-1997 the emerging financial crisis in South East Asia started dramatically slowing sales. So for the first time in our relationship Kondo-san and I had to face the fact that sales were plummeting and orders to Japan would have to be reduced immediately otherwise overstock would kill our joint cash flow very quickly (these products are expensive to build).
    Kondo-san absolutely refused to face up to this fact and make the necessary adjustments to his overheads. So instead of dealing with the problem himself and seek our co-operation to minimise the damage, Mr. Kondo pushed the entire responsibility on to ANUK’s shoulders by demanding that we “fulfil our obligation”. This was in his view that we should buy a minimum of what he could produce to keep staff and turnover regardless of whether we could sell it or not, in other words, ANUK owed him a living regardless of market conditions.
    This I in turn refused to do, so stalemate ensued.
    Until April 1998 when Kondo-san with complete disregard of all practical facts, our entire history together, all past understandings and with no consultation or prior warning whatsoever gave a UK company, PM Components Ltd., all rights to distributing his products. This in itself was bad enough, considering how the market for these products had been developed, but to add insult to injury and in direct conflict with our common interests (and with ill concealed malicious intent, I now believe). Mr. Kondo also licensed PM to use the Audio Note™ brand name whilst renouncing our use of it, completely disregarding the following facts,
    a.)Turnover wise AN-J was very much the junior partner in the relationship, despite its longer history, and ANUK represented at least 80% of AN-J’s turnover.
    b.)His ill-considered, irresponsible and callously one-sided action put the 30 or so jobs at ANUK in jeopardy by creating great uncertainty about the brand’s long term future. In addition to that putting 1000’s of our customers’ investments in our products in question through a potential loss of warranty and service back-up should ANUK fail as a result of his actions. ANUK’s turnover at its peak in 1997 was well over £ 4,000,000.00 and that represents a lot of customers’ investments in the future. How can he single-handedly decide to attempt to scrap that?
    c.)The reality was and is that whilst the brand name originated in Japan, the ownership of the brand name had long since passed to ANUK through the way the original agreement was structured and the fact that the brand name recognition was paid for and created solely through ANUK efforts.
    d.)PM Components had no experience in this sector of the market, a sector solely created by ANUK.
    Interestingly and surprisingly, it appears that the terms granted PM were substantially less severe than what Kondo-san had demanded of ANUK in order to renew our agreement. One can only wonder why?
    When you add the above up, I did what anyone else in my position would do, in order to protect our employees jobs, our customers and our own investment and ANUK’s future, I sued AN-J and PM. We soon won the first round, an injunction preventing AN-J from giving a licence to the name to PM effectively blocking its use.
    So since it was Kondo-san who broke our co-operation and made the decision to venture out on his own, what is he so aggrieved and resentful about? Let me give you a brief analysis for your consideration.
    1.) Without ANUK’s involvement in 1990, he would still have a small company in Japan, making high quality audio products. He still has, what happened from 1990 to 1997 were in the most part due to my efforts not his, so any profits or experience he has gained as a result should be considered a benefit, not a disadvantage.
    2.) He is not longer travelling to shows that I pay for, showing demonstration amplifiers that I also finance. True, because to do this he needs to work within the framework of my strategy and concepts, using my money and my contacts built up over 20 years of selling quality music reproduction equipment. But this was his own choice, so why am I being blamed?
    3.) He would have been unknown to most audiophiles because contrary to his own internal beliefs, Kondo-san became famous through my staff’s, our distributors’ and my efforts to put him in the limelight and explain our joint philosophy to the world. In this regard we gave Kondo-san a head start not many in the audio industry have had the benefit of, how can he be unhappy with that? His decision to leave the partnership has done all the damage necessary and nowhere has this been more clearly demonstrated than what has happened to our joint reputation, as a result, our time has been spent on damage limitation and thinking up new products.
    4.) So now all he is having to do is what I did when we started seriously promoting Audio Note in the late 1980’s, start with an unknown brand name (Kondo) and build it to fame and fortune himself. Still without the drawback of complete obscurity (testament to our success putting Kondo-san in the limelight is the fact that you read his posting and that you are reading this now). The clock has been turned back to 1989, due in no small part to Kondo-sans own inability to act responsibly, logically and with respect for other peoples efforts, commitment, time and money.
    All in all, misplaced anger and aggression rarely gets you anywhere, hard work generally does. So do what I did with the ONGAKU and our other products, go out, demonstrate your products successfully enough to be able to convince people to part with their money and show people that your products are as good as you believe they are.
    Regardless of what anyone may think, I would like Kondo-san to do well, partly because I genuinely believe he deserves to, but partly also for more selfish reasons, who else is there out there to compete with at the very leading edge of audio technology?
    Nothing drives you better forward than the hot breath of a benign, likeminded, but pursuing competitor!
    I truly cherish the prospect of a genuine intellectual and practical competition with Kondo-san over whose creativity, ideas and skills result in the products with the best sound quality. In my opinion such a competition is in everybody’s interest and should benefit the knowledge base and debate generally. As a starting shot I am gratified to see that Mr. Kondo has adopted my suggestion of 1993, in his new d/a converter, of removing the over sampling and digital filters and replacing them with a simple analogue filter. I regard this new Kondo product a great recognition of the idea, so thank you for that Kondo-san!
    There will always be some of you who prefer a different dynamic balance to the voice that my products speak with, so there is room for us all and if you are in the market for the best, both Kondo-sans and my products should definitely be on your shortlist.

    This requires Mr. Kondo to stop wasting his time slandering and back stabbing ANUK and strictly concentrate on spending his time promoting his new products instead, which is more fun, more profitable and more positive anyway!

    At the end of the day it is worth remembering that the treasure does not belong to the one who says he knows where it is buried, but to the one who invests in looking for it and as a result eventually finds it.

    A simple truth, this particularly applies to anyone who claims that I usurped their “idea” of the over sampling free digital filter less DAC, as Justin Benn claims in his follow-up to Kondo-sans posting. This practice has, for your information, been around since the very first CD-players in 1982, so anyone who thinks this was their idea will have had to have been up mighty early, another severe case of sour grapes if you pardon my saying so.

    The first Sony 16Bit machines used no over sampling or digital filters with a brick wall analogue filter, it sounded terrible. The novelty of our idea is to configure the analogue filter such that it does as little damage to the signal as possible.

    I welcome debate on this and other matters.

    Peter Qvortrup
    Audio Note UK Ltd
    18.01.2000
     

    JanR

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    65finger skrev:
    FallenA skrev:
    Prøvde å finne "den andre siden av historien", men finner ikke noe konkret.
    Så om noen har en lenke.....??! ;)
    har hørt denne og andre historier om PQ tidligere. Tror det er riktig. Synd fordet er noen veldig bra produkter i "AN" utvalget
    Mye sant i "ryktene"

    Igjen, for min del ser jeg ikke noe grunn til å boikotte AN uk produkter. Meg om det.
    Brukelige produkter har de, ikke tvil.

    /jan
     

    LMC

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    pengesluk skrev:
    LMC skrev:
    og PQ ler hele veien til banken , som vanlig ;D
    mvh
    Leif
    Han ER banken.
    det tviler jeg på at Danske skattemyndigheter er enig i; det var grunnen til at han stakk til UK
    ellers er han gnistrende flink og en god selger
    noen designer er han ikke,men han omgir seg med en del kreative folk
    mvh
    Leif
     

    bambadoo

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    I forhold til mange andre produkter synes jeg ikke Jinro er spesielt avskrekkende priset.

    PQ er en idemaker, en glimrende selger, god retoriker og har gode teknikere og designere rundt seg.
     

    BangBang

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    bambadoo skrev:
    I forhold til mange andre produkter synes jeg ikke Jinro er spesielt avskrekkende priset.

    PQ er en idemaker, en glimrende selger, god retoriker og har gode teknikere og designere rundt seg.
    Alt er jo relativt ;)

    Man får vel bygget noen rimelig gode "blokker", og en god pre for den prisen.
    Men "nybil følelsen", og det å eie noe "originalt" betyr nok muligens endel.

    Skal man først legge såpass i ny forsterker løsning så er det nok viktig å sondere terrenget.
    Men på tross for det.... Jinro virker utrolig spennende, og selv om jeg aldri har hørt en Ongaku så synes jeg at det ville være veldig morro å eie en ;) Men det er nok ganske så uoppnåelig for min del. Men om man får en "nesten" Ongaku for 1/4 del av prisen er det ikke helt urealistisk heller.

    Man får se litt. En slik investering skjer nok ikke sånn ASAP.
    I skrivende stund tikker det inn en melding om at siste kalkulert pris i Norge er kommet opp i 150K :eek:
     

    LMC

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    om man regner "baklengs" koster den(Jinro) kanskje 15-20K å bygge
    til sammenlikning kostet en riaa jeg bygget på bestilling(lik min uten TVC og volumdelen) 66K i deler!
    og da snakker vi nesten 50kg psu full av jern og deler+ selve signaldelen
    skulle man bygge slikt for kommersiel distribusjon,hvilken kalkyle skulle man bruke da?
    nei PQ priser psykologisk for å pirre statusmarkedet
    og det virker
    mvh
    Leif
     

    BangBang

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    LMC skrev:
    om man regner "baklengs" koster den(Jinro) kanskje 15-20K å bygge
    til sammenlikning kostet en riaa jeg bygget på bestilling(lik min uten TVC og volumdelen) 66K i deler!
    og da snakker vi nesten 50kg psu full av jern og deler+ selve signaldelen
    skulle man bygge slikt for kommersiel distribusjon,hvilken kalkyle skulle man bruke da?
    nei PQ priser psykologisk for å pirre statusmarkedet
    og det virker
    mvh
    Leif
    Ja... kalkylene er nok dessverre såpass ekstreme.
    Men dette er jo et fenomen som ikke nødvendigvis bare gjelder AN.
    Det peker også i den retningen at man kommer rimelig heftig opp i lydkvalitet om man velger et eller annet kit.
    Være seg mono blokker eller en integrert løsning.

    For min egen del er sakene laaaangt i fra avgjort, men må innrømme at Jinro virker spennede. Men Jinro er jo ikke alene om å inneha en sånn posisjon i hodet mitt ;)
     

    Hornlyd

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    Vel vel. Jeg ser frem til å få min enkle M2 Line tilbake fra Upgrade Audio (en liten reparasjon + ny internkabling med nye rca kontakter og bedre inngangsvelger). Vi vanlige proletarer får nøye oss med komponenter uten japanske navn på :D
     

    BangBang

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    hel skrev:
    Vel vel. Jeg ser frem til å få min enkle M2 Line tilbake fra Upgrade Audio (en liten reparasjon + ny internkabling med nye rca kontakter og bedre inngangsvelger). Vi vanlige proletarer får nøye oss med komponenter uten japanske navn på :D
    Må si at jeg var særdeles fornøyd med mitt "bolede" Kit1.
    Problemet er at den er for svak for mine kommende høyttalere.
    Når det kommer til komponenter med japanske navn så er de (ihvertfall når man snakker AN) i den svært uoppnåelige enden av skalaen.
    Jinro er i så måte ikke noe (jeg ihvertfall) kan handle over natten, men heller ikke et helt uoppnåelig mål.
    Men så er det det med å få så mye som mulig for pengene. Da tviler jeg på at den strekker til.
    Det betyr allikevel ikke at den er utelukket.
    Drømme litt må man jo få gjøre uansett.

    For meg med 10 tommeltotter når det gjelder å skru sammen elektronikk, så er det heller ikke realistisk å gjøre noe slikt selv. Men jeg beundrer de som kan, som har denne kompetansen, og har tålmodighet til å lære seg "triksene" :)
     

    bambadoo

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    Å regne baklengs er alltid interessant.
    NOS WE300b kostet maks 10kr å bygge - og går for 10000+ nå.

    Vi har eksempler (solid state) der produkter (regnet baklengs) maks kostet 300 kr å bygge - som går for 55000. Da heller ikke håndlaget som point to point wired rørsleder.

    Fremdeles synes jeg ikke Jinro er værste i klassen. De enda dyrere (sogon Høyttalerene, Ongaku, Kegon Balanced, M10, AN S9 etc. er absurd priset) det er jeg enig i.

    AN er priset høyt - altfor høyt, men de er ikke værst i klassen. Endel sveitsiske og amerikanske firma bl.a. synes jeg er mye værre.
     

    LMC

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    ref noen som kjenner AN UK fra "innsiden" er det INGEN som har betalt mere enn max halv pris for ONGAKU
    ALLE elsker å få en god deal og PQ ler like godt hele veien til banken
    mvh
    Leif
     

    impulse

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    Kit 1 er i alle fall ikke for liten for dine kommende høyttalere om du bruker litt mer penger på boling og setter inn bedre trafoer, powersupply og et sett WE-rør, Fallen..... ;D
     

    LMC

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    ja FM preampen er hovedsaklig den samme som fra 80 tallet og der har de bare jekket prisen opp i "statussfæren" ;D
    men når du kan selge en jalla LV veske til flere hundre tusen, er vel alt mulig
    i forfengelighetens tegn
    mvh
    Leif
     

    LMC

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    apropos WE300B ....lages de mere? noen som har de på lager?
    de to parene som ligger på fleabay koster hhvis 3400 og 6500 usd!
    mvh
    Leif
     

    BangBang

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    impulse skrev:
    Kit 1 er i alle fall ikke for liten for dine kommende høyttalere om du bruker litt mer penger på boling og setter inn bedre trafoer, powersupply og et sett WE-rør, Fallen..... ;D
    Nå er jo Kit 1 solgt..... men om jeg skulle spyttet i såpass på Kit 1 har man en del andre alternativer som også er morsomme. Jeg er allikevel ikke helt overbevist over om Kit 1 hadde levert nok power til min musikk, og mine spillevaner.
    (seff.... WE og BP PSU kunne jo vært morro det ;))
    Men det blir morsomt å prøve litt forskjellig.

    Har du vært og sett/hørt de BTW?
     

    BangBang

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    LMC skrev:
    apropos WE300B ....lages de mere? noen som har de på lager?
    de to parene som ligger på fleabay koster hhvis 3400 og 6500 usd!
    mvh
    Leif
    http://tubedepot.com/


    Edit:

    Teksten under rørene sier følgende....

    The Western Electric factory is moving to a new, dedicated location. Once established, the 300B line will be running to catch up on all back orders. Projected date for availability is late 2010. If you order now, the soonest you will receive tubes is sometime in 2011. Thank you for your patience.

    Så da er vi antakelig like langt :-\
     

    LMC

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    NOS er for dyrt
    jeg har to par foreløpig,men... ::)
    mvh
    Leif
     

    U-96

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    Hei folkens,

    Eg skal i dag av stad å hente mitt aller første Audio Note produkt i form av ein DAC One 1X. Denne har eg tenkt å bruke i kombinasjon med squeezebox og ein Sugden A21a.

    Då eg manglar rca coaxial kabel lurer eg på om det er nokon her på tråden som kan kome med ei anbefaling av type kabel eg bør bruke til dette og kor eg kan kjøpe den? Kunne tenk meg ei lengde på 1,5 m, men dette er ikkje eit must. Må sei at eg aldrig har vert nokon kabelfanatikar, men er open for forslag i alle prisklassar om begrunnelsen er god nok. Helst bør eg få tak i kabelen i dag då trangen til å få prøvd dacen er stor, hehe, befinner meg i Oslo.

    Helsing U-96
     
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